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my son and the way he prays

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vicky

Senior Member
Hi,
Many of you have been following the story of my five year old son and his recent memories of past lives.
He also does a couple of other things. One thing he has done for the last couple of years is he prays. The position he is in when he prays is what is so striking. I'll try to describe it. He is face down with only his knees and elbows touching the ground. His hands are clasped together in a praying position at the level of his forehead and his hands are touching his forehead.
I wanted to know if any of you have ever seen anyone pray like this. I know he's had at least one lifetime in Africa (he was black) and one in Japan. The rest sound like they took place here in the U.S.
He will also just drop to the ground and pray wherever he is. In his classroom at school, on the boardwalk in our town, anywhere. Sometimes, he says he's praying for a new toy and sometimes its real odd. One time he told me he was praying for Moses to come back to life and live on this earth.
I wish there was some kind of class we could go to with him that would explain all of this confusion like how he got here, astral projection (he does that too), etc.
He jokes a lot about killing himself. I think its the only way he can think of to get back to his past life family and to try to put it all together. He told me once, he wanted us all (him, daddy and I) to die to so we could all go to heaven together.
The astral projection is of particular concern to me because he tries to do it while he is awake. Any white rope he can get ahold of, he puts it around his waist and jumps off of his bunkbed. We take the ropes from him, we hide them, he is relentless. He even took the rope off of a toy bow one time and tied it around his waist. He untied a rope from our neighbor's boat, he found a rope in the woods. Once while playing at a friend's house, he tied his friend's rope around his waist and then went down a slide with his arms up. The rope then slipped up around his neck and caused a nasty rope burn. I was not there when that happened.
He also has trouble staying focused. I wanted to know if that was common in children with past life memories.
He is very loved; a child that came miraculously after many years of infertility.
I would appreciate any advice or help.
Vicky
 
my son and the way he prays

Hi Fab,
Thanks for looking that up for me. Wish I was as skilled at the computer. I don't know where to begin to look this stuff up.
Anyway, he prays somewhat differently than the man in the photo. His elbows touch the ground and his hands are clasped together in a praying type position at his forehead.
Vicky
 
vicky, I don't think your son's way of praying is unusual, although it may seem unusual in the West. I am saying this based on experience and practice. In the East, and I can speak for India better than for rest of the East, praying positions are not prescribed by society, church, mosque, etc. and each person adopts a position that suits him and expresses him, which is how it should be. It is sad but true that religion has eliminated spontaneity and suppressed natural self-expression in man's relationship with god. Thus when societies regiment personal expression even in something that should be very personal such as prayer, personal uniqueness stands out. Isn't it nice that some, like you son, can hark back to their past, and cherish a continuing relationship with god?
 
Hi Kris,
Yes, I think its beautiful. I think he's beautiful. I love his little soul and the sincerity with which he approaches his relationship with God. I have asked him what he is praying about and sometimes he tells me and sometimes he says its between him and God. I love this - that his relationship with God exists at all and that it is personal and private to him.
I'm curious about his past lives so that's why the prayer position strikes me so. I know its nothing he's ever seen in this life but he has been doing from the moment he learned the word for prayer. I have also heard him pray in what sounds like may be a different language. This is hard to tell because he kind of whispers when he prays and I want to allow him his privacy. Still though I am intensely curious about this lifetime.
Everything will come out when he is ready and needs to talk or not. I just try to give him the opportunity by laying down with him at night and talking to him before he goes to sleep.
Vicky
 
In (Catholic) monasteries there are several ways to pray.
And to show total devotion to God.
Some monks lay almost flat on the ground with their armed stretched in front of them.
Only the hands are faulted.

I don't know what they call this kind of praying, but I've seen it once in a documentary.
It's a medieval religious order that still exists, maybe the Cistercians or the Carmelites.

Perhaps this site tells you more about Roman Catholic habits: www.newadvent.org

But that's just a guess :)

Curious Girl.
 
Thanks curious girl. I checked out the website and didn't find it there but it gave me the idea and the words to use to look in other sites on the web. I still didn't find it but I think I'm closer.
I might take a photo of him when he does this sometime and post it on this website. See what you all think. Its easier for you see it than it is for me to describe it.
Thanks for the website. Like I said it gave me some ideas and I learned a lot about prayer that i didn't know.
Vicky
 
Another lifetime....

I was just talking to my 5 year old son. He was telling me that I was being too grown up and talking about too many grown up things. He told me that all little kids know this man and his name is Martin William. He said Martin William helps them. He said that MArtin William used to be a real man and he fought in the French Army and they fought the British. (history was definitely not my subject so I don't know if this even happened) He talked about the Red Coats and I think they were British. He said that he trained to fight from a young age and his family were all soldiers. Then he said he wasn't sure which side he was on.
He said that Martin William died and he turned to stone. (sounded like rigormortis) He said that was o.k. though because an angel or a fairy came and waved something ( I didn't get that part but maybe her arm) over him and he came back to life. My son said that Martin William came back to life later as Martin Luther King but that he didn't remember that he was ever Martin William. He just learned about Martin Luther King so I don't know if something is getting mixed in or if learning about Martin Luther King sparked the memory.
He pointed to his cheek where he has had a red mark since he was a baby (but not since he was born) and said, 'this is where I was shot with an arrow.'
He also said that I was his friend in that life and Daddy was his brother. I do have a memory of something like that but there were indians in my memory.
He told me they spoke British English
O.K. my husband just told me that the French did join with the Uroquois Indians here and the British fought against them. My husband thinks our son got this information from Last of the Mohicans but my husband doesn't believe in any of this. Our son has watched a very short cartoon version of Last of the Mohicans but it was over year ago.
The other weird thing is he also told me that he knows how to make paper that doesn't tear but you can bend and fold it. (sounds like parchment) He also told me about food coloring that you put in a bottle and then dip a pencil in it to write with. He said it wasn't really food coloring but was like permanent marker ink and that it could not be erased. He also described melting something that looked like an eraser (wax??) to seal the paper with.
The war - maybe it is from the Last of the Mohicans but the details on parchment and how to make ink and names - I don't think he's making it up. I'm going to google martin William and see if I get anything.
He asked me why he thinks of these things. He himself says it feels like it is a dream and he has a hard time telling if it really happened. I'm no expert but I think that's how the memories come sometimes in dreams and sometimes they feel like dreams.
Glad you all are here.
Vicky
 
I thought it was pretty amazing what he said about being shot in the cheek where he has a birthmark... It really sounds like a PL memory! He could have picked any other part of his body... Why the cheek? ;)
You mentioned having some sort of memories involving indians... Perhaps the same lifetime your son is describing?
Have you thought about having a regression yourself, Vicky? I wonder if you can remember the lifetime you and your son were together. :)

The details on parchment and what the said about how to make ink and names don't seem to be something that a 5 year old would know... I agree that it doesnt' seem like he would be able to make that up.
I am curious to know what you are going to find about "Martin William" on the net!

Good luck on your search and keep us posted! :)
 
Hi Fab,
I have thought about a regression but it was when i was still a little doubtful about reincarnation and the person that I went to see was a psychic and she decided not to regress me but to do a reading instead.
I'm not that interested in regression for myself but if I could help my son, I'd do it. I do find it fascinating that our memories match.
He has been getting better with his bedtime issues, being too scared to go to sleep etc. He's been doing well for the last 2 - 3 weeks but is having trouble right now. I imagine it has to do with this memory. No rest for weary mommy.
He's calling me right now to heat up his teddy bear that is stuffed with lavendar.
Vicky
 
This is getting freaky...

O.K. I left out some details because I thought my post was getting too long. My son told me that William Martin was his father but that he was also William Martin. I didn't get that at first but....
A quick google found William Martin Sr. died in 1762 and he had three children. One of them was William Martin Jr. and he had two brothers. My son said that his Daddy now was his brother then and I was his friend.
Also looked up the French Indian War also known as the hundred year war which lasted from 1689-1763. They were British that moved here to America which explains why my son said they spoke British English. Wow!!!! Feels like proof.
My husband suggested that I look up The Last of the Mohicans to see if William Martin was mentioned in the story but I couldn't find him. In fact, upon looking at William Martin's life, there was nothing really special. There was a copy of his will and it mentioned sheep, a wallet, very few possessions, so he wasn't rich.
 
Wow! That really sounds like a validation! :)
It would be awesome if you could find out more about William Martin Jr. (your son) and possibly how he died... That could help you understand your son's feelings! I am wondering if he carried over some issues from that lifetime.
I am going to do a search too. ;)
 
Hi fab,
I might have spazzed out a little. Good enough reason to think before I post next time. My son did initially say Martin William but then said William Martin. I typed in Martin William but William Martin came up. I don't know if I'm convinced about the Martin Luther King part but my son has been very interested in learning about him. Anyway, I think that's what has confused the name. Interesting that he said that Martin William died and came back to life as Martin Luther King but that he didn't remember being Martin William or William Martin or whoever the guy is.
My son said that Martin William, his father died in battle and I can't imagine he could survive an arrow to the cheek. It'd be interesting to find out how they died.
I can't seem to open links when others type them in their posts but I'd be very interested to know what you found.
I checked our Last of the Mohicans book and did not see a William Martin or Martin William.
I'm still fascinated even if my son is unclear about the name.
Vicky
 
Try typing this in the address bar. http://www.angelfire.com/tx/lineage/ and this is page 2 if the link to Willima Martin Jr. on that page doesn't work for you. http://www.angelfire.com/tx/lineage/william2.html

It's really fascinating. Since it mentions three generations of William Martins, it is possible the naming trend goes further back than those three generations.

I haven't read the Last of the Mohicans, but I sincerely doubt your son could have gotten all those details from a Last of the Mohicans cartoon. There is some information on the two brothers of William Martins on that page too.
 
If I can put my historical knowledge to good use:

I thought about the seven year war which ended in 1763 by the conquest of New-France by the british empire.

...Iroquois and the French? ..That can't be right. In Canada Iroquois were strong allies of the Enlgish troops and the biggest fear of any French. But the French were allied with the Huron.
It is very normal for you to remember amerindians in this life since they were really present.

....It was a war between France and Britain so the english were coming directly from England of course. And, yes, the british were the red coats. the French were blue.

I quickly looked for a William Martin that could have faught in the French war and found one who moved from the US to Halifax, NS, Canada with the British troops around those dates. ...It would make sense then that he probably was fighting against the forteresse of Louisbourg in Cape Breton.

....................

I would just like to add that in that link Chelle gave they talk about a "Abraham Martin" being the brother of William Martin. .......For a second I thought it could have been the Abraham Martin after whom were named the plains of Abraham in Quebec (where the famous battle that gave quebec city to the british was faught). Whose daughter's daughter maried my ancestor.

...But he's french and lived in canada, so I doubt it's the same one. I just thought the connection would have been fun if it would have been the same one.
 
Hi Rimbaldienne,
Its nice to have so many people with historical knowledge on the forum. I did look up what you mentioned about the 7 year war. Looks like at one time the Iroquois were o.k. with both the French and the British but then allied themselves with the British. The Iroquois apparently tried to have a passive role in the conflict. This explains my memory of being injured and my friends set me down on a small hill or tree stump. Some indians came up and were poking me with their spears but not hurting me. My friends didn't seem concerned about the indians.
The other interesting thing that I read was that the governor of Virginia sent a militia force to attack the French near Pittsburgh. One third of them died in the fighting.
The William Martin that I looked up, which seemed to be the same one that Chelle found was from Brunswick, West Virginia. He had three sons, one of them also named William (possibly) and one of the others was, like you said, Abraham. My son said that his daddy now was his brother then and I was his friend. The oldest William Martin would have died right near the end of the 7 year war.
I have a question - my son tells me he isn't certain whether this is a dream or if he's really remembering something. Should I tell him what I've found out???
Vicky
 
Actually the British and the French have a long history of fighting each other, both in Europe and in North America. A red uniform doesn't necessarily mean a soldier in a war before World War I was British. Various regiments in various countries had widely different uniforms, including different colors, in the armies of different countries. Britain was unusual in having nearly all regiments in the same color, but even they had exceptions.

Also, unless he's definitely said this life was in North America, a lot of Irish Catholics emigrated to France before Napoleon, i.e. before the 1790s, and fought in the French army as mercenaries.

Sealing wax does and did come in sticks, which are melted onto the paper before the seal is applied. I am old enough to remember the fashion for doing this back in the 1960s. It's not likely that a modern child would know this, however.

Interesting case you have there!
 
Hi Cecily,
I asked him which side William Martin fought on and first he said the French, then he said 'no, we were called the Red Coats so we must have fought against the French.' He also said that he spoke British English. He mentioned indians somewhere in all of this story but no detail about the indians that I can recall. It wasn't until I looked up William Martin, that I saw the year and figured out which war it was. I guess I could be wrong though but it seems like the Seven Year War or the 100 Year War.
Vicky
 
Cecily has a good point that Britain and France has a very long history of fighting against each other. But I guess it's this mention of amerindians that makes it more likely to have happened in North America, and in that period of time.
Also, though it's true that other armies than British probably had a red uniform, the name "red coats" was attributed mostly to British troops.

vicky said:
Looks like at one time the Iroquois were o.k. with both the French and the British but then allied themselves with the British. The Iroquois apparently tried to have a passive role in the conflict. This explains my memory of being injured and my friends set me down on a small hill or tree stump. Some indians came up and were poking me with their spears but not hurting me. My friends didn't seem concerned about the indians.
Click to expand...

Your memory could also be of an amerindian of another clan than Iroquois. Depending on which side you were and where the life happened.
It could also be a possibility that your friends weren't concerned because you already knew those amerindians and were friends with them.
All my knowledge is more on New-France, but to what I know the sight of an unknown amerindian would cause panic in the hearts of white men.

- It is possible that during the seven year war they decided to take no side and just act for themselves (Iroquois I mean).
I know that, during the time of New-France, the French who lived on the coasts of the St-Lawrence lived in constant fear of Iroquois attacks....The town I live in right now was very much unpopulated at the time because of the regular attacks. ...But I couldn't say when it all stoped.
 
Hmmm,
It all makes me think. Now that you mention it, I can't remember the exact reference to the American Indians other than that I thought he said Iroquois. The only other reference my son made to Indians was to state that the red mark he has had on his cheek since just after he was born came from an arrow that struck him there in that lifetime. So, maybe I assumed Indians from that.
I wish I remembered more from history class. Thank God for the internet and my husband's history books.
I guess in the long run, it probably won't matter if I figure this out, but its very fascinating to try.
Vicky
 
Well, if he really lived in the period of time we think, I don't think Europeans used arrows. so it could be a theory to concider.

Maybe you could ask him about it?
 
My son

My six year old son was playing with his friend tonight. I heard his friend getting a little upset so I called them in to talk about it. My son tends to get amnesia when he has to talk about something he's said or done that we may not like. However, he was more resistant than usual.
His friend said though that my son had told him that he had to be dead because he had 'wasted his last life.' He told him that 'he had already lived 99 lives but he had wasted the last one so he would die early in this one.'
His friend was kind of freaked out and i am wondering if some kids do know these things. Its unlikely he saw this on a cartoon. He has told me about several of his past lives but its not really something he likes to talk about and only does so when he's trying to deal with a specific memory.
Vicky
 
Nobody, kids or grownups, really knows how long we have to live. Sure we all have hunches, but in my book, hunch is not knowledge. As for children with past life memories, it is best to prod them back into this life. We are not supposed to live past lives. Our business is this life.
 
kris0503 said:
As for children with past life memories, it is best to prod them back into this life. We are not supposed to live past lives. Our business is this life.
Click to expand...

Sure, we should never live exclusively in the past, but personally I can see no harm in remembering past lives. I agree with you that it can be a problem if the past-life stuff overwhelms the present life, but as long as everything stays within its normal boundaries...

Under normal circumstances nobody can know how long they're going to live, but whether Vicky's son had a hunch or real knowledge doesn't matter here, I think - the idea alone that such a young child can come up with such a thing must have been scary!
 
What I keep thinking is maybe there is some universal truth that he knows about that indicates if you waste a life that you die early in your next one. Its freaky enough that I would never mention it to the other boy's mother, even though she is one of my best friends.
Kris, I am beginning to understand what you are saying about keeping the kids focused on this life. You've been saying this to me for awhile now and I'm finally starting to get it. If my son could forget now, things would be much simpler but he just turned 6 and he's still remembering more.
However, when he tells me that I have to listen to him because he has been born more times than I have or has been to heaven more times than i have, I tell him that may or may not be true but either way he helped God choose me to be his mommy in this life, I'm here to love him, keep him safe, make sure he takes a bath etc. I'm thinking just because a child remembers past lives doesn't mean they get to be snotty to their mother about it.
There have been other instances where i've had to redirect him to this life and the things that need his attention now. Its the fears and the bedtime issues that cannot be manuevered around. I believe they are past life related because of what he says. There seems to be no way around that. Just because you tell a child not to think about something or that they need to live in this life doesn't mean they can. I think there is a way to talk to kids to help them through this. Unfortunately, I haven't found it yet.
Vicky
 
vicky said:
What I keep thinking is maybe there is some universal truth that he knows about that indicates if you waste a life that you die early in your next one.
Click to expand...
vicky, I often write about karma here and elsewhere and and usually mention natural laws like the laws of motion as examples. But when I think of karma privately, laws of motion are farthest from my mind. Law of karma is above all a law about morals and ethics. It is about universal moral truths that govern the field of law. I also think that most human beings are naturally capable of comprehending it. What compromises our innate knowledge of morals is the corruption of our natural faculties by the influence of arbitrary and senseless human laws generally put forth by religions as rules made by God.
I'm thinking just because a child remembers past lives doesn't mean they get to be snotty to their mother about it. For me, it is a given that wasting one's life will have bad consequences.
Click to expand...
I am glad you have good sense of humor to deal with it. :)
Its the fears and the bedtime issues that cannot be manuevered around. I believe they are past life related because of what he says. There seems to be no way around that. Just because you tell a child not to think about something or that they need to live in this life doesn't mean they can. I think there is a way to talk to kids to help them through this. Unfortunately, I haven't found it yet.
Click to expand...
I understand your predicament. This is where I would remind him of god someone he already knows about. Hope this makes some sense.
 
HI Vicky,

You are doing such a great job of researching as well as being open to the possibilities. It isn't an easy thing to do.

Kris - as far as your statement ....
Sure we all have hunches, but in my book, hunch is not knowledge. As for children with past life memories, it is best to prod them back into this life. We are not supposed to live past lives. Our business is this life.
Click to expand...

I would like to remind you of another statement you made -- in another post to thepeople which I think applies to Vicky's case. ;).

I think that all events register in the universe at the level of AkAsha. The record of history is never erased there. While most of us do not normally have access to that record, some do. Also, no event and no record is an end in itself. Every event / record generates consequences. We are some of those consequences. We are connected to those records.
Click to expand...

Vicky - perhaps you can research HOW to help your son consciously move his attention and intentions to a positive outcome. In other words - there are meditations, prayers, and selective awareness exercises that you can do with him to help him visualize a positive outcome for his friend. That way - his internal energies will be focused on the positive -the compassion - and may help him also find internal peace at the same time.
 
vicky said:
However, when he tells me that I have to listen to him because he has been born more times than I have or has been to heaven more times than i have, I tell him that may or may not be true but either way he helped God choose me to be his mommy in this life, I'm here to love him, keep him safe, make sure he takes a bath etc. I'm thinking just because a child remembers past lives doesn't mean they get to be snotty to their mother about it.
Click to expand...

Very true,Vicky! Your son has chosen to have such a loving and understanding mother like you for a reason, IMO. :)
Perhaps this is not only about his memories... I wouldn't be surprised if you ever find out that you two have been together in many lifetimes. ;) :)
 
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